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Old 04-20-2017, 02:16 PM   #1
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Question Can One Man Lead the GLC?

Under John's watch the GLC has slowly been crippled as far as numbers go. To the point he's aligned himself with the remains of the Sinestro Corps currently being lead by Soranik Natu [daughter of Sinestro and former GL]. There's plenty of reasons why this doesn't make sense, namely the fact the majority of the Sinestros attacked Earth. I'd offer Natu her GL ring back and maybe one or two redeemable Yellow Lanterns... but not any large number of them. Do the remaining Green Lanterns even have enough numbers to evenly pick up the slack? I mean, if there's 600 GLs do they each now protect 6 sectors each?

To get to the point, is John Stewart capable of running the entire GLC? Is any one man really up to the task? Even Hal's run as 'leader' had it's problems.

In the absence of the Guardians of the Universe I think a better solution would be a Lantern Council made up of senior ranking GL's who made decisions based on votes. John could still be among them and maybe include Salaak [for being the Guardians right hand], and Protocol Officer], Kilowog [for being Chief Instructor], Stel [also for being an Instructor], Natu [if/when she becomes a GL again for her medical background and feats], Torquemada [for his knowledge on the alien supernatural], Tomar Tu [if he's still the keeper of the Book of Oa, I think that may be Salaak now though], and Green Man [who I'd make the LAST Alpha Lantern].

Thoughts? Would you do a Lantern Council, and if so who would you add? Do you think the Guardians should return or that Ganthet and Sayd need to stop dicking around with Blues and come home to the GLC? Will we ever find out what happened to the Templar Guardians?

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Old 04-20-2017, 02:43 PM   #2
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A council would be a good idea, but in general a paramilitary organization should have a point man that can answer questions that need to be answered in a second, not after a committee meeting. The GotU got around that problem because they were telepathically linked and unemotional.
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Old 04-20-2017, 03:46 PM   #3
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A council would be a good idea, but in general a paramilitary organization should have a point man that can answer questions that need to be answered in a second, not after a committee meeting. The GotU got around that problem because they were telepathically linked and unemotional.
Simple enough, put Salaak on point. He can be the chairman or whatever. It just makes no sense that a human would run an entire alien police force single handed. A lot of the aliens hate Earth Lanterns anyway, to make one the head of the GLC?!?

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Old 04-20-2017, 03:58 PM   #4
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I always liked the bit about how Salaak could do multiple things with his arms.
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Old 04-20-2017, 04:20 PM   #5
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I think a council is better, but I still think that to really work and be effective the GLC NEEDS the Guardians. They may have been a bit abrasive at times (until Geoff turned them outright evil), but their vast knowledge and immortal perspective really seem indispensable to a mission of protecting the universe in any meaningful fashion. I just don't think the GLC, run by a GL or even a council of them, would have the knowledge/wisdom/perspective necessary to pursue any larger, long-term goals of protecting the universe as a whole vs. just randomly policing tiny bits of it as the opportunity presents itself to whoever happens to be nearby.
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Old 04-20-2017, 05:00 PM   #6
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I think a council is better, but I still think that to really work and be effective the GLC NEEDS the Guardians. They may have been a bit abrasive at times (until Geoff turned them outright evil), but their vast knowledge and immortal perspective really seem indispensable to a mission of protecting the universe in any meaningful fashion. I just don't think the GLC, run by a GL or even a council of them, would have the knowledge/wisdom/perspective necessary to pursue any larger, long-term goals of protecting the universe as a whole vs. just randomly policing tiny bits of it as the opportunity presents itself to whoever happens to be nearby.
That's why the Book of Oa needs to come into play and the 10 Laws fleshed out. And not just two or three of them. It's one of the better plot points still left to tinker with. All that knowledge and wisdom may not come in the ring's AI, but the Book coming back could be interesting in many ways. They don't have to bring back the Guardians because their influence could still be there.

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Old 04-20-2017, 05:11 PM   #7
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I suppose they could have the Book play a Guardian-esque role, but the 10-laws should be left behind. To bring them up again would require either retconning what the revealed ones were, or else dealing with how stupid they were. I mean they supposedly wrote the 10 laws all at once, but the first was totally redundant in light of the second, the third was idiotic (and was repealed)...they didn't at ALL seem like important laws that were part of a well-thought-out plan, but rather like knee-jerk, ill-considered reactions to whatever happened to be going on at the moment (despite them all having supposedly been written at once, in advance of the events that they SEEMED to be reacting to).
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Old 04-20-2017, 05:36 PM   #8
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Yeah I'd completely retcon the original Laws they revealed since most of them were moot. It'd be ten solid laws, two of which would be something the human GL's would be most likely to break.

One law would deal with sector jurisdiction. Only Council members and Honor Guard should be able to venture into any sector. A cosmic crisis would of course require special attention and be warranted though. Give GL's jurisdiction in their sector and like another four, two in each direction. Hal or whomever could be the GL of sector 2814 but operate between 2812-2816. Bring back Sector Houses as well.

Mandatory R&R for Honor Guardsman after every three missions. I'd put something like this into play so once in awhile Kyle and Guy could have an Earth adventure as well as have another home away from the GLC.

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Old 04-20-2017, 05:47 PM   #9
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Mandatory R&R seems rather out-of-character for something the Guardians would have written, in almost any version I can think of. Even when they were depicted as competent and wise, they didn't usually seem to give a lot of thought to the comfort of the mortals under their command.
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Old 04-20-2017, 06:04 PM   #10
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Mandatory R&R seems rather out-of-character for something the Guardians would have written, in almost any version I can think of. Even when they were depicted as competent and wise, they didn't usually seem to give a lot of thought to the comfort of the mortals under their command.
Which is why it'd only be mandatory for the Honor Guardsman.

I attribute it to such laws like "mandatory breaks for X amount of work, yadda yadda.."

In my mind the Honor Guard would get more large scale action and would need more time to heal both physically and mentally. A GLC title would likely have equal amounts of Council, Honor Guard, and standard GLs. Then once in awhile we get a Kyle or Guy story on Earth or possibly staying in their Sector House.

EDIT: To me, the only thing the GLC comic has ever really lacked in was structure within the Corps. Just a little more could go a long way.

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Old 04-20-2017, 10:21 PM   #11
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From a narrative point of view, killing off the Guardians has added NOTHING to the story, aside from perhaps the shock (if you felt any) of the moment when it happened, and having the Templar Guardians journey around some with Kyle Rayner, which you could do without killing the Guardians.

A lot of the time, I think comics writers and editors just do things without thinking of, "Well, how is this going to serve future stories and where am I going to go with this?" I guess that's kinda' understandable, because so many different people work on the stories over time.

For John Stewart's character, his being leader hasn't done anything of note except give him better reason to interact with Soranik Natu, if that's even at all important. If there was a story ABOUT him becoming leader, which shows why he is worthy of being leader, then that certainly would have helped. But he was just quietly elected to that position off panel for some reason. I suppose you could argue Van Jensen and Robert Venditti's New 52 Green Lantern Corps was about that, but if it was, that particular aspect wasn't handled especially well, if you ask me.

From an in story point of view, I'm not sure how wise it is for any one man to be solely in charge of the universal police, to where his word is apparently law... but it doesn't sound very wise. I'm also not sure how wise it is it is to absolve multiple known criminals, murderers, rapists, and whatnot from their crimes and then make them the police. Actually, I do know how wise that is, and the answer is "not very". It's hard for me to believe these characters would become good because Sinestro isn't around, and Arkillo got beat up. And even if they did become good, if John Stewart was just, I don't think he'd excuse ALL of these high level criminals.

Really, a good writer, if they REALLY wanted to do that, would ask themselves, "Why would that make sense, and why would this John Stewart character do that?" And if they want the story to be taken seriously, they would have to come up with a REALLY good reason. I don't proclaim to be a master, but whenever I write fiction, and I go from point A to point B, if everything doesn't link up really solidly, I ask myself, why would that happen, and then I sit around, brainstorm, and contrive reasons that make sense within the context of the story, and world build stuff to where it makes sense, if need be.

To me, it seems to make no sense that John Stewart would ally with the Sinestro Corps, and appoint them universal peacekeepers, whether the Green Lantern Corps is undermanned or not. I'm seeing John Stewart is giving characters like Karu-Sil and Low the option of becoming police if they want to behave, but it's also my understanding that these characters and their ilk have intentionally committed atrocities, and from my point of view, it would be a disgrace to not only not hold them accountable for them, but to give them the authority of police officers. Being undermanned isn't a good enough reason, in my eyes, to do that. There are other, much better alternatives, like send out more GL rings, train the users, and organically build the Corps back up that way.

So, no, the story, as it appears to me, doesn't make a lot of sense.
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Old 04-21-2017, 01:15 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by Star-Lantern View Post
From a narrative point of view, killing off the Guardians has added NOTHING to the story, aside from perhaps the shock (if you felt any) of the moment when it happened, and having the Templar Guardians journey around some with Kyle Rayner, which you could do without killing the Guardians.

A lot of the time, I think comics writers and editors just do things without thinking of, "Well, how is this going to serve future stories and where am I going to go with this?" I guess that's kinda' understandable, because so many different people work on the stories over time.

For John Stewart's character, his being leader hasn't done anything of note except give him better reason to interact with Soranik Natu, if that's even at all important. If there was a story ABOUT him becoming leader, which shows why he is worthy of being leader, then that certainly would have helped. But he was just quietly elected to that position off panel for some reason. I suppose you could argue Van Jensen and Robert Venditti's New 52 Green Lantern Corps was about that, but if it was, that particular aspect wasn't handled especially well, if you ask me.

From an in story point of view, I'm not sure how wise it is for any one man to be solely in charge of the universal police, to where his word is apparently law... but it doesn't sound very wise. I'm also not sure how wise it is it is to absolve multiple known criminals, murderers, rapists, and whatnot from their crimes and then make them the police. Actually, I do know how wise that is, and the answer is "not very". It's hard for me to believe these characters would become good because Sinestro isn't around, and Arkillo got beat up. And even if they did become good, if John Stewart was just, I don't think he'd excuse ALL of these high level criminals.

Really, a good writer, if they REALLY wanted to do that, would ask themselves, "Why would that make sense, and why would this John Stewart character do that?" And if they want the story to be taken seriously, they would have to come up with a REALLY good reason. I don't proclaim to be a master, but whenever I write fiction, and I go from point A to point B, if everything doesn't link up really solidly, I ask myself, why would that happen, and then I sit around, brainstorm, and contrive reasons that make sense within the context of the story, and world build stuff to where it makes sense, if need be.

To me, it seems to make no sense that John Stewart would ally with the Sinestro Corps, and appoint them universal peacekeepers, whether the Green Lantern Corps is undermanned or not. I'm seeing John Stewart is giving characters like Karu-Sil and Low the option of becoming police if they want to behave, but it's also my understanding that these characters and their ilk have intentionally committed atrocities, and from my point of view, it would be a disgrace to not only not hold them accountable for them, but to give them the authority of police officers. Being undermanned isn't a good enough reason, in my eyes, to do that. There are other, much better alternatives, like send out more GL rings, train the users, and organically build the Corps back up that way.

So, no, the story, as it appears to me, doesn't make a lot of sense.
Just reboot it and bring back the Guardians. Problem solved.
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Old 04-21-2017, 01:15 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by Star-Lantern View Post
From a narrative point of view, killing off the Guardians has added NOTHING to the story, aside from perhaps the shock (if you felt any) of the moment when it happened, and having the Templar Guardians journey around some with Kyle Rayner, which you could do without killing the Guardians.

A lot of the time, I think comics writers and editors just do things without thinking of, "Well, how is this going to serve future stories and where am I going to go with this?" I guess that's kinda' understandable, because so many different people work on the stories over time.

For John Stewart's character, his being leader hasn't done anything of note except give him better reason to interact with Soranik Natu, if that's even at all important. If there was a story ABOUT him becoming leader, which shows why he is worthy of being leader, then that certainly would have helped. But he was just quietly elected to that position off panel for some reason. I suppose you could argue Van Jensen and Robert Venditti's New 52 Green Lantern Corps was about that, but if it was, that particular aspect wasn't handled especially well, if you ask me.

From an in story point of view, I'm not sure how wise it is for any one man to be solely in charge of the universal police, to where his word is apparently law... but it doesn't sound very wise. I'm also not sure how wise it is it is to absolve multiple known criminals, murderers, rapists, and whatnot from their crimes and then make them the police. Actually, I do know how wise that is, and the answer is "not very". It's hard for me to believe these characters would become good because Sinestro isn't around, and Arkillo got beat up. And even if they did become good, if John Stewart was just, I don't think he'd excuse ALL of these high level criminals.

Really, a good writer, if they REALLY wanted to do that, would ask themselves, "Why would that make sense, and why would this John Stewart character do that?" And if they want the story to be taken seriously, they would have to come up with a REALLY good reason. I don't proclaim to be a master, but whenever I write fiction, and I go from point A to point B, if everything doesn't link up really solidly, I ask myself, why would that happen, and then I sit around, brainstorm, and contrive reasons that make sense within the context of the story, and world build stuff to where it makes sense, if need be.

To me, it seems to make no sense that John Stewart would ally with the Sinestro Corps, and appoint them universal peacekeepers, whether the Green Lantern Corps is undermanned or not. I'm seeing John Stewart is giving characters like Karu-Sil and Low the option of becoming police if they want to behave, but it's also my understanding that these characters and their ilk have intentionally committed atrocities, and from my point of view, it would be a disgrace to not only not hold them accountable for them, but to give them the authority of police officers. Being undermanned isn't a good enough reason, in my eyes, to do that. There are other, much better alternatives, like send out more GL rings, train the users, and organically build the Corps back up that way.

So, no, the story, as it appears to me, doesn't make a lot of sense.
Just reboot it and bring back the Guardians. Problem solved.
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Old 04-21-2017, 01:48 PM   #14
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Because writers have handled them SO well in the past. [/sarcasm]

If the X-Men can survive without Prof. X then surely the GLC can get by without the Guardians. They just gotta give us more than we're getting. The comic is all flash with no substance. Kyle becoming green again after that random shit he did with no real explanation of what he was supposed to be doing? He basically put his hands on Saint Walker's head, gave him a seizure, then his white ring turned into a pack of skittles. EVS art is good, but it doesn't tell that much of the damn story.

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Old 04-21-2017, 05:48 PM   #15
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Because writers have handled them SO well in the past. [/sarcasm]

If the X-Men can survive without Prof. X then surely the GLC can get by without the Guardians. They just gotta give us more than we're getting. The comic is all flash with no substance. Kyle becoming green again after that random shit he did with no real explanation of what he was supposed to be doing? He basically put his hands on Saint Walker's head, gave him a seizure, then his white ring turned into a pack of skittles. EVS art is good, but it doesn't tell that much of the damn story.

~//V\\~
Actually, aside from Geoff, I've been pretty happy with how other writers handled the Guardians. Well, OK, maybe Marz's handling was poor, too, what with them being idiots in ET, and then dead, then babies, but I at least liked Ganthet, and their time being dead was presumably not something he got to choose.

And the X-men aren't supposed to be protecting the entire universe, with powers given to them deliberately by those in charge. I think the analogy falls apart. I think the GLC really SHOULD have the Guardians.
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Old 04-21-2017, 06:27 PM   #16
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Actually, aside from Geoff, I've been pretty happy with how other writers handled the Guardians. Well, OK, maybe Marz's handling was poor, too, what with them being idiots in ET, and then dead, then babies, but I at least liked Ganthet, and their time being dead was presumably not something he got to choose.

And the X-men aren't supposed to be protecting the entire universe, with powers given to them deliberately by those in charge. I think the analogy falls apart. I think the GLC really SHOULD have the Guardians.
The Guardians wish to protect the universe, but it's always been the Lanterns doing all the work. The Corps can live the dream without them like they're doing now, it could just be done better. With something returning like the Book of Oa and a new 10 Laws, things would run much smoother without them and there's much more story potential. All the Guardians were ever good for were being cryptic and prophesying future events. Otherwise every story leads to them or one of them in particular being a bad guy.

And the Guardians let a ring go to a dude named Sinestro. For immortals, they're idiots.

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Old 04-21-2017, 07:46 PM   #17
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Eh, to each there own. I'd be happier with actual Guardians filling the role you would leave to the Book of Oa. And why not? After all, aren't we to presume that the Guardians CREATED the Book of Oa? As to them being idiots...well they don't have to be, and usually aren't portrayed as such. And Sinestro as evidence of their idiocy? Nah. I'd say the relative LACK of GLs that went bad, given the huge amount of power they wield, and the effect power so often has on people, argues for them being pretty smart, actually. I don't put much stock in the notion that they should have judged him based on his NAME.
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Old 04-21-2017, 10:14 PM   #18
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cough *Manhunters murdered an entire space sector* cough

^^^Testament to their idiocy.

I wouldn't give a weapon to a guy named Joey Psycho or trust a guy named William Murderface with my life.... but I guess I'm in the minority LOL

And if the Oans know all, then they should've known most of the good supervillains have a mustache... Krona, Sinestro, that GL who went evil in Kyle's New Corps, etc... Only way Sinestro would've looked more sinister is if he was petting a Persian cat...

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Old 04-21-2017, 10:34 PM   #19
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cough *Manhunters murdered an entire space sector* cough

^^^Testament to their idiocy.

I wouldn't give a weapon to a guy named Joey Psycho or trust a guy named William Murderface with my life.... but I guess I'm in the minority LOL

And if the Oans know all, then they should've known most of the good supervillains have a mustache... Krona, Sinestro, that GL who went evil in Kyle's New Corps, etc... Only way Sinestro would've looked more sinister is if he was petting a Persian cat...

~//V\\~
The thing with the Manhunters just shows that they can make mistakes, and that when you work on a grand scale your mistakes can have repercussions that are equally large. And in fact, the Manhunters actually WORKED for thousands of years, so the mistake was a long time in revealing itself. (It also goes to show that creating a race of sentient robots is never a good idea, but back when the GUARDIANS did it, none of the examples we have to show us that were around yet. )They learned from that mistake and followed it up with successes that spanned a greater amount of time than humanity has had control of fire.

It is also worth noting that the Manhunters destroying all life in a sector was a retcon by Geoff Johns. Prior to that they had rebelled, but there was no mention of the event having that kind of death toll. If I recall correctly, originally they turned on the Guardians, and the Guardians took them down in short order. No mention of a huge massacre. But since Geoff's plan was to make the Guardians look as incompetent and evil as possible, so people would be fine with it when he got rid of them, he deliberately played up their mistakes to be much larger (and created new ones). Looks like his strategy worked on you.
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Old 04-21-2017, 11:52 PM   #20
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I was only ever a fan of Ganthet, but in reality he wasn't even around for 99% of the Kyle era.

The X-Men can live on without Prof. X. SHIELD can survive without Nick Fury. Batman doesn't need Robin. And the GLC can make it without the Guardians.

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Old 04-22-2017, 12:47 AM   #21
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I was only ever a fan of Ganthet, but in reality he wasn't even around for 99% of the Kyle era.

The X-Men can live on without Prof. X. SHIELD can survive without Nick Fury. Batman doesn't need Robin. And the GLC can make it without the Guardians.

~//V\\~
Eh, I disagree, but you know that by now.

I'm not saying the comic can't SELL without the Guardians, or that it can't tell interesting stories. I'm just saying that, as I understand the purpose of the GLC, without SOMETHING in the Guardian role it is just too implausible to me that they would actually have much of an impact on the universe as a whole. John Stewart, much as I like the character (or at least, liked earlier iterations a whole lot...not so much lately, since he hasn't been very interesting of late), doesn't have the knowledge or experience I feel is needed to make running a universal force for justice and order practical, and while I feel like a council would be better, it doesn't work for me either. The GLC is such a grandiose concept (ludicrous really, if you think of the scale of it) that I feel like it needs some kind of Deus ex Machina behind the scenes in charge to make it seem like it could really work.
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Old 04-22-2017, 01:37 AM   #22
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... It is also worth noting that the Manhunters destroying all life in a sector was a retcon by Geoff Johns. ... But since Geoff's plan was to make the Guardians look as incompetent and evil as possible, so people would be fine with it when he got rid of them, he deliberately played up their mistakes to be much larger (and created new ones). Looks like his strategy worked on you.
It's funny how some of the Geoffcons have become accepted lore. It also seems to be generally believed that GLs overcome fear (not that they're fearless) and always have. And Geoff's characterization of Hal as a total womanizing horndog made it to the movie. Before Geoff, Hal had a number of girlfriends but not more than most heroes and he was never a one-night-stand kind of guy before vol. 4.
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Old 04-22-2017, 01:38 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by Mister Ed View Post
Eh, I disagree, but you know that by now.

I'm not saying the comic can't SELL without the Guardians, or that it can't tell interesting stories. I'm just saying that, as I understand the purpose of the GLC, without SOMETHING in the Guardian role it is just too implausible to me that they would actually have much of an impact on the universe as a whole. John Stewart, much as I like the character (or at least, liked earlier iterations a whole lot...not so much lately, since he hasn't been very interesting of late), doesn't have the knowledge or experience I feel is needed to make running a universal force for justice and order practical, and while I feel like a council would be better, it doesn't work for me either. The GLC is such a grandiose concept (ludicrous really, if you think of the scale of it) that I feel like it needs some kind of Deus ex Machina behind the scenes in charge to make it seem like it could really work.
The Deus ex Machina that is the Guardians just leads to more confusion though when you get down to it. They always have plans for whatever the universe has in it's future but then something always goes to shit that they somehow didn't see coming with all their grande power. Sure that works once or twice but now we've seen it to death. The only times that the Guardians were worth a damn, IMHO, was when they were BEHIND the scenes behind the scenes. You maybe saw them or heard something about them once or twice a year. And when you DID see them, it was when one was communicating with a Lantern like Hal or it was one of those "oh shit, the Guardians came outside?!?" situations like Willy Wonka.

I'm fine with the Guardians being around and having an impact without taking away four pages of character development from other characters every other issue. The Guardians have had like 100x the panel time that Hal's former civilian life has had since he returned from the grave even before the New52. The editors of the GL books should be ashamed of that fact after they made such a big deal about getting him back to basics and his test pilot roots.

And where we're at now in the comics with so few GL's left, John joining forces with the Sinestros, and Baz and Jess not even getting involved with what's going on with the rest of the Corps... it makes absolutely no sense. The Renegade Hal arc made more sense than this direction.

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Old 04-22-2017, 02:33 AM   #24
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It's funny how some of the Geoffcons have become accepted lore. It also seems to be generally believed that GLs overcome fear (not that they're fearless) and always have. And Geoff's characterization of Hal as a total womanizing horndog made it to the movie. Before Geoff, Hal had a number of girlfriends but not more than most heroes and he was never a one-night-stand kind of guy before vol. 4.
Everything's become accepted lore because everything is almost ten years old in the comics and they're still milking it for everything they can like it was still 2010. Until a massive reboot of the GL franchise happens or Geoff himself rewrites their corner of the universe ala Flashpoint, I don't expect any of the stuff introduced since the Sinestro Corps War to get written off. Had Geoff not written it himself, Larfleeze would've never went from such a force of nature in the Vega System to being a comical thief of a character.

Geoff is a great creator and can take inspiration from anything when creating new material to expand a universe of characters and concepts, but when other writers try to follow him on titles it's always disastrous. The Others in Aquaman were incredible! The Others written by Dan Jurgens... not so much. Rage of the Red Lanterns was good, and written by Geoff. The Red Lanterns title during the New52? Not what I was looking for... it DID last a bit longer than I expected it to though. JSA by Geoff IMHO was some incredible work 90% of the time, but even creators as well received as Jerry Ordway and James Robinson couldn't get the fans hooked like Geoff.

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Old 04-22-2017, 02:57 AM   #25
Big Daddy Dave Targaryen I
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For me, the franchise is off course and needs to be reigned in. The mythology suffers without the Guardians and Oa. They need to come back. And having the Corps be depleted of members beyond belief has become VERY stale. It seems like only at one point since before COIE has the Corps' ranks been at full capacity. And that was a very brief moment during the beginning of Johns' run.

I don't think one human should run the GLC, nor ANY humans. Not even one or a few Guardians. There needs to be dozens of them again.
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