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Old 04-25-2017, 04:28 PM   #1
Trey Strain
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Default Do identity politics sell comics?

What do you think?

http://thefederalist.com/2017/04/25/...hurting-sales/
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Old 04-25-2017, 04:57 PM   #2
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Identity politics have always sold comics.
Or is straight and white not an identity?

I mean hell, straight white and male is statistically a minority identity.
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Old 04-25-2017, 05:22 PM   #3
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I dunno. If I approached a comics publisher with a marketing proposal that had been shown would decrease his sales by 11 percent, I'm pretty sure he'd throw me out of his office.

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Old 04-25-2017, 11:14 PM   #4
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It doesn't, or shouldn't, take a genius to realize that fans want their clasic heroes to be their classic heroes. Big shocker that their sales are dwindling.
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Old 04-25-2017, 11:33 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Daddy Dave Targaryen I View Post
It doesn't, or shouldn't, take a genius to realize that fans want their clasic heroes to be their classic heroes. Big shocker that their sales are dwindling.
Besides that, it's just about impossible to get any major new super-hero over in comics now. I believe the last undisputed star that Marvel got over was Wolverine in 1974. Comics have not been a growth industry for a long time. They're well into the mature phase of their life cycle.

Any new super-hero who you add now will probably need to play a supporting role or a team role. You're not going to snap your fingers and get a black female substitute Iron Man over. That might sell, but don't bet your company on it.
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Old 04-25-2017, 11:44 PM   #6
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They sure got Deadpool and Harley Quinn over. DC and Marvel shouldn't stop trying, but success is like catching lighning in a bottle. Thats why the classic heroes are the classic heroes they are.

I say they should keep trying, but stop this nonsense of replacing the popular heroes with chicks and minorities. It got old years ago.
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Old 04-25-2017, 11:59 PM   #7
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Yes, Deadpool has been around since 1991 and Kyle since 1994. That's still a long time ago. And Harley came from the Batman cartoons. So no breakout characters from the comics for a quarter-century. It's not impossible to break one out now in the comics, but the odds are very small.

Anyway, what the hell is wrong with creating supporting characters? Everybody doesn't have to be a star.
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Old 04-26-2017, 12:00 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Daddy Dave Targaryen I View Post
They sure got Deadpool and Harley Quinn over. DC and Marvel shouldn't stop trying, but success is like catching lighning in a bottle. . .
Well, even Harley hit big as Joker's girlfriend and sidekick. She's remained popular even apart from him as an antihero, but it seems like a lot of her fans miss her clown outfit/identity.
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Old 04-26-2017, 12:05 AM   #9
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I still think DC shouldn't give up on trying with Static.
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Old 04-26-2017, 12:13 AM   #10
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I still think DC shouldn't give up on trying with Static.
I never understood the appeal of Static and I say that as someone who thinks we lost a comics great when Dwayne McDuffie died.
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Old 04-26-2017, 03:29 AM   #11
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How many websites are going to bite this story like diversity is what killed the label? Read the original article. Of something like 103 new series published by Marvel in the last 2-3 years, only about 30 of them starred a more PC hero. 75% of those 100+ books still had white male leads.... and they STILL can't catch a break.

The diversity helped decrease sales, but it can't be considered the biggest factor. I blame it on the lame ass gimmick that is this patchwork planet, event fatigue, and the fact the end of events lately have been delayed despite the NEXT event starting already. And the fact they're handicapping their universe by not using characters as much who's film rights belong to Fox....

~//V\\~

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Old 04-26-2017, 03:41 AM   #12
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I never understood the appeal of Static and I say that as someone who thinks we lost a comics great when Dwayne McDuffie died.
Static was like the black equivalent of Spiderman in the Milestone universe. In the 90's the appeal was in how real the comic felt, just enough grit to see they were going more for realism in some situations. He had the same effect on the 90's that Black Lightning had in the 70's.

If you weren't a fan of Static, what great comics do you think McDuffie worked on? I thought his best work was as a writer for the JLU cartoon series myself. His JLoA was good, and he did it for the sole purpose of integrating the Milestone characters back into the DCU... then nothing came from it other than Static on a sub-par Teen Titans team. A Static series was planned and in production, then when McDuffie died it turned into a Static Special. Then the new52 Static just sucked...

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Old 04-26-2017, 11:22 AM   #13
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Maybe "identity politics" isn't quite the way to put it. Maybe "virtue signaling" says it better.
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Old 04-26-2017, 01:09 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by -//V\\- View Post
Static was like the black equivalent of Spiderman in the Milestone universe. In the 90's the appeal was in how real the comic felt, just enough grit to see they were going more for realism in some situations. He had the same effect on the 90's that Black Lightning had in the 70's.
That's probably why, then. I don't like Superman and I like my comics mythic.

Quote:
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If you weren't a fan of Static, what great comics do you think McDuffie worked on? I thought his best work was as a writer for the JLU cartoon series myself...
That's it. His animation work. Although I do have some other McDuffie-scribed DC comics and I've always liked them, but can't remember what they were.
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Old 04-26-2017, 07:40 PM   #15
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Yo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by -//V\\- View Post
The diversity helped decrease sales, but it can't be considered the biggest factor. I blame it on the lame ass gimmick that is this patchwork planet, event fatigue, and the fact the end of events lately have been delayed despite the NEXT event starting already. And the fact they're handicapping their universe by not using characters as much who's film rights belong to Fox....





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Geoff Johns should have a 10 mile restraining order from comic books, let alone films.
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Old 04-26-2017, 07:45 PM   #16
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It's almost as if putting effort into decent storytelling brings in, and keeps, readers.
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Old 04-26-2017, 07:59 PM   #17
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Lord knows Marvel and DC haven't tried it in a decade.
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Old 04-26-2017, 08:51 PM   #18
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Common sense should tell anyone that gratuitously replacing a popular comics character with a minority member who nobody asked for, as an exercise in virtue signaling, will be bad for your business. How could it not be?

This ain't 1939. It's next to impossible to get major new super-heroes over now, even legacy characters.

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Old 04-26-2017, 09:09 PM   #19
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Marvel's comics sales would really be in the toilet if it hadn't acquired the Star Wars rights. DC's sales are up, but almost solely because of the twice-monthly publishing, and you're welcome for that idea, DC.

This is just not an industry that's going to grow any more. It's like landlines. It's not about to go away, but the comics companies can't just say, "We're going to sell this particular thing that we want to sell," and then somehow it's going to happen. They're limited as to what people will buy.

People will eagerly buy certain comics that are way over, like Batman and Star Wars, but the days when selling comics was like shooting fish in a barrel are long gone.
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Old 04-27-2017, 11:15 AM   #20
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A good question to ask yourself is, are you selling what you want to sell, or are you selling what people will buy? Sometimes they're the same thing, but sometimes they're not.

http://www.blastr.com/2017-3-31/marv...more-diversity
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Old 04-27-2017, 01:32 PM   #21
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Jason Whitlock tweeted something similar about yesterday's mass layoffs at ESPN.

Jason Whitlock ✔ @WhitlockJason
When you pursue a political agenda rather than a business agenda and people lose their jobs, remember: No One Is To Blame.
8:41 AM - 26 Apr 2017
441 441 Retweets 1,089 1,089 likes
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Old 04-27-2017, 05:31 PM   #22
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Yo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trey Strain View Post
Common sense should tell anyone that gratuitously replacing a popular comics character with a minority member who nobody asked for, as an exercise in virtue signaling, will be bad for your business. How could it not be?
I don't think that in & of itself is bad for business; I think the problem lies with the extent to which Marvel has done so.

IM - changed & swapped
FF - gone
Wolverine - changed AND gone AND swapped
Cap - changed
Thor - changed & swapped
Hulk - gone AND changed AND swapped

that's ALOT, and in a small amount of time too.
:/




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Old 04-27-2017, 08:57 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trey Strain View Post
Marvel's comics sales would really be in the toilet if it hadn't acquired the Star Wars rights. DC's sales are up, but almost solely because of the twice-monthly publishing, and you're welcome for that idea, DC.
Yeah dude... because Marvel wasn't doing that for the last couple years with titles like Amazing Spiderman. It was your own completely original idea. Man...

I fail to see how one person can be so full of themselves and think they know EVERYTHING about comics, movies, and marketing when they've never had a comic published, been involved in a major motion picture, etc. You state your opinions like they're facts, and its social media sites looking at pissed off fans [who probably only buys 2-4 comics a month IF that] like yourself when they're writing all these 'Diversity Killed Marvel' stories. Over one hundred new titles in the last 2-3 years and only a third were about minorities. One could also see that as "White Characters Don't Sell" at Marvel, but no... let's keep on giving them shit because they're trying to give more people heroes they can relate to.

You wanna know what killed Marvel? And I won't even copy/paste the response from earlier cause I can go a little deeper.... and as much as you claim I'm on ignore I know you still log off and check the forums and up the views on shit like your fanfic. So read on, ya might learn something old man.

* Giving Brian Michael Bendis any title he wants, no matter what idiocy he had planned... and that involves so many characters getting shit on...

* The Patchwork Planet that would NEVER go over as well as a standard Earth. Imagine half your family dying, then reappearing but altered to some degree. Imagine the governments losing their shit because all of the political factions are in shambles. What about currency, is it all the same? Do people with 616 currency think everything from the 1610 is counterfeit?

* New events starting before the ending of the previous event. And events in general.

* Marvel thinking 6 or 7 Deadpool titles will sell as well or better than the *main* Deadpool book.

* Pushing characters like Squirrel Girl when DOZENS of others deserve a little limelight. If Black Knight's series got half the push Squirrel Girl gets he'd still have an ongoing title right now.

* Not publishing GOOD X-titles or F4 titles to spite Fox and handicapping a good fraction of their universe. Now we're stuck with this super shitty X-Men universe that's as unrecognizable as Sir Patrick Stewart in drag [he makes a convincing old lady...]. And do they give Johnny or Ben ongoings? Nope, just spots on other teams...


~//V\\~

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Old 04-28-2017, 04:54 PM   #24
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She knows it.

http://nypost.com/2017/04/27/sportsc...-hurting-espn/
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Old 05-16-2017, 11:42 PM   #25
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Its not working because nobody in their right mind is going to pay good money to be demonized in the process. There are ways to attract Minority customers without needing to demonize Whites [the majority of comic book buyers] Even IDW's M.A.S.K is terrible for it. The good guys are all Minorities [or People of Color is the newer expression] and the bad guys are all White. I can't even see an issue ever making it to print if this had been reversed.
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